Former Minister of Defence and Ambassador Thomas Aguiyi-Ironsi spoke to Abuja Deputy Bureau Chief, MADU ONUORAH on the Niger Delta, security, and the political situation in Nigeria. Excerpts:
WHAT do you make of the security situation in Nigeria?
The nation's security situation is precarious. I am not blaming any individual or institutions, as security should be the business of everyone. Obviously our security machinery has to be revamped and strengthened. Something close to the "Homeland Security" machinery as instituted in the United States is urgently required here. Our borders remain porous.
It may not be the best thing to be too detailed about our security concerns in the media but with increasing urbanisation and the emergence of mega cities, security challenges will continue to rise. There is a close relationship between hunger and political instability that also increases security concerns. 'Taliban' and religious zealots,' including politicians can recruit hungry students and these would raise security problems.
Our reoriented Armed Forces will defend the constitution; our security agencies must be supported, funded, and need to rise to the challenges of curbing criminal activities. Government needs to act now just as Nigerians have to learn that even with our problems, many nations are jealous of us. But still, we need to copy the example of other nations who have devised home grown methods to manage their security.
The amnesty proclaimed for militants in the Niger Delta has attracted a lot of criticisms. Can you give an insight into how we can have genuine peace in the region?
I applaud the former President, Chief Olusegun Obasanjo for admitting that mistakes were made in the Niger Delta and that Nigerians must share in the mistakes. I have no problem in Niger Delta taking 100 per cent of oil revenues and paying tax to the Federal Government to run security, foreign affairs, judiciary, information and other issues in the exclusive list. If we decide to use nuclear energy in future from uranium in Bauchi, then that state should also pay taxes.
The amnesty programme may have its flaws, but it is a step in the right direction. People talk about 'soft power.' And that is what Obasanjo utilised for the Niger Delta. 'Soft power' is the ability to obtain preferred outcomes through attraction by shaping preferences and setting an agenda. 'Hard power' on the other hand is said to be 'coercion and payment.' The current administration favours this tactic.
What is important is for the militants to agree that Nigeria is for us all, surrender their arms and give government an opportunity to develop the area under a set agenda. In the search for peace in the region, criminality however should not be tolerated. Obviously a mix of 'soft and hard' power could ensure genuine development of the Niger Delta.
Finally, it should be noted that the Armed Forces traditionally use the stick. But ours can also use the carrot, as some of our best engineers are in the Armed Forces. They can build bridges, schools, roads and other infrastructure that is, if the atmosphere is conducive in the Niger Delta. We must be more innovative in solving our problems.
How do we stop the current spate of kidnappings, which has spread from the Niger Delta to other parts of Nigeria especially the South East?
This is beyond hunger and unemployment. Those who are pathological criminals need to be found out and punished accordingly. Our security agencies have to rise up to this challenge. Those involved in this scourge need to be purged and in the final analysis all hands must be on deck to ensure an environment where people have things to do. An idle mind is the devil's workshop. The government and the private sector must create more jobs. Government must ensure that the qualification obtained by youths enable them to be self-employed and employable.
How do you think the deadlock between the Academic Staff Union of Universities (ASUU) and the Federal Government can be broken?
The Government must look at other social costs involved in the ongoing ASUU strike. Frank dialogue is required to ensure that higher education does not continue to suffer. Mrs Oby Ezekwesili had courageously tried to revamp the problems in the nation's education system. I believe many of her ideas are still relevant in our effort to move the country's educational system forward. I believe what we need in Nigeria is quality and not quantity, and drastic measures need to be undertaken to achieve an improved educational system.
Why do you think that the current political and economic situation is responsible for the insecurity in Nigeria and how do we fix this?
Cross carpeting appears to be the current issue. Perhaps that aspect needs to be re-examined to ensure that peoples' votes count for something. We are watching to see how the review of the constitution proceeds. I favour the South East being given an additional state; and individual candidates at all tiers of government would ginger the bigger parties not to remain complacent but to focus on the electorate, and not that of a party machinery.
We have oil but right now, countries that also have oil now surround us. President Musa Umaru Yar'Adua will need to set up a think tank under the National Security Adviser to review our future options and relationship with the Organisation of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC).
Agriculture must be a strategic sector of our economy as we diversify to solid mineral and tourism. But there are questions like, how do we create jobs for our youths; what should we produce; what should we export; should the state interfere in the market? Nigerians want solutions to these questions.
As a former envoy, how do we improve the standard of Nigeria's international relations and leverage our international standing for the benefit of the people?
I believe our standing is not good but will continue to be better. No one is going to give us a Marshal plan. We are not Europe, Japan or Iraq where investments poured in. We will have to secure assistance from institutions such as Bill Gates Foundation and others. It is also not enough to say that too much military rule has caused our problems. I prefer to posit that the "dividends of democracy" have to be better distributed for use to improve our standing in the international community.
Nigeria has the resources to make nations, especially in Africa worry if we sneeze or cough. The Federal Government has continued to reform our foreign policy machinery. But more funds will assist the work that has to be done, especially in elevating our relationship with organisations like the Economic Community of West African States (ECOWAS), where we need to co-ordinate more values, and capabilities.
As a Foreign Service Officer in Niger Republic in the 1980's, I had to dispel the notion among the youths that Nigeria was a dangerous country where you can be eaten as meat. I did not blame the French for this misinformation. As an ambassador in 2004, I was trying to convince our francophone brothers that it was not true that all Nigerians had the power to make people's body parts disappear.
Certain films from Nigeria did not help to portray Nigerians in good light. We need to re-brand. We must continue to emphasise our obvious strengths while working and praying to overcome our weaknesses.
What is your impression of development in Abia State and do you think the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) has a future in the State?
...In terms of how I want Abia to be, frankly, the first issue must be a secure environment. In the 1970's, even when people were still hungry due to the civil war, one could go to the cinema and walk back home by midnight. Today, that is not possible.
In spite of palliative measures taken by the Abia government, Orji must tackle the issue of energy generation, even if it means taking up local initiatives, especially utilising gas. The above measures will help to ensure an enabling environment to move the state forward.
Of course, if he also follows President Yar'Adua's seven point agenda, he will have all the prerequisites to ensure good governance now and possibly in 2011. Abia citizens are not happy with the current developments in the state. They are not yet ready to sacrifice and assist with necessary funds to assist current government. Hopefully good leadership in the state will result in these funds being transferred home, sooner rather than later. FULL STORY
WHAT do you make of the security situation in Nigeria?
The nation's security situation is precarious. I am not blaming any individual or institutions, as security should be the business of everyone. Obviously our security machinery has to be revamped and strengthened. Something close to the "Homeland Security" machinery as instituted in the United States is urgently required here. Our borders remain porous.
It may not be the best thing to be too detailed about our security concerns in the media but with increasing urbanisation and the emergence of mega cities, security challenges will continue to rise. There is a close relationship between hunger and political instability that also increases security concerns. 'Taliban' and religious zealots,' including politicians can recruit hungry students and these would raise security problems.
Our reoriented Armed Forces will defend the constitution; our security agencies must be supported, funded, and need to rise to the challenges of curbing criminal activities. Government needs to act now just as Nigerians have to learn that even with our problems, many nations are jealous of us. But still, we need to copy the example of other nations who have devised home grown methods to manage their security.
The amnesty proclaimed for militants in the Niger Delta has attracted a lot of criticisms. Can you give an insight into how we can have genuine peace in the region?
I applaud the former President, Chief Olusegun Obasanjo for admitting that mistakes were made in the Niger Delta and that Nigerians must share in the mistakes. I have no problem in Niger Delta taking 100 per cent of oil revenues and paying tax to the Federal Government to run security, foreign affairs, judiciary, information and other issues in the exclusive list. If we decide to use nuclear energy in future from uranium in Bauchi, then that state should also pay taxes.
The amnesty programme may have its flaws, but it is a step in the right direction. People talk about 'soft power.' And that is what Obasanjo utilised for the Niger Delta. 'Soft power' is the ability to obtain preferred outcomes through attraction by shaping preferences and setting an agenda. 'Hard power' on the other hand is said to be 'coercion and payment.' The current administration favours this tactic.
What is important is for the militants to agree that Nigeria is for us all, surrender their arms and give government an opportunity to develop the area under a set agenda. In the search for peace in the region, criminality however should not be tolerated. Obviously a mix of 'soft and hard' power could ensure genuine development of the Niger Delta.
Finally, it should be noted that the Armed Forces traditionally use the stick. But ours can also use the carrot, as some of our best engineers are in the Armed Forces. They can build bridges, schools, roads and other infrastructure that is, if the atmosphere is conducive in the Niger Delta. We must be more innovative in solving our problems.
How do we stop the current spate of kidnappings, which has spread from the Niger Delta to other parts of Nigeria especially the South East?
This is beyond hunger and unemployment. Those who are pathological criminals need to be found out and punished accordingly. Our security agencies have to rise up to this challenge. Those involved in this scourge need to be purged and in the final analysis all hands must be on deck to ensure an environment where people have things to do. An idle mind is the devil's workshop. The government and the private sector must create more jobs. Government must ensure that the qualification obtained by youths enable them to be self-employed and employable.
How do you think the deadlock between the Academic Staff Union of Universities (ASUU) and the Federal Government can be broken?
The Government must look at other social costs involved in the ongoing ASUU strike. Frank dialogue is required to ensure that higher education does not continue to suffer. Mrs Oby Ezekwesili had courageously tried to revamp the problems in the nation's education system. I believe many of her ideas are still relevant in our effort to move the country's educational system forward. I believe what we need in Nigeria is quality and not quantity, and drastic measures need to be undertaken to achieve an improved educational system.
Why do you think that the current political and economic situation is responsible for the insecurity in Nigeria and how do we fix this?
Cross carpeting appears to be the current issue. Perhaps that aspect needs to be re-examined to ensure that peoples' votes count for something. We are watching to see how the review of the constitution proceeds. I favour the South East being given an additional state; and individual candidates at all tiers of government would ginger the bigger parties not to remain complacent but to focus on the electorate, and not that of a party machinery.
We have oil but right now, countries that also have oil now surround us. President Musa Umaru Yar'Adua will need to set up a think tank under the National Security Adviser to review our future options and relationship with the Organisation of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC).
Agriculture must be a strategic sector of our economy as we diversify to solid mineral and tourism. But there are questions like, how do we create jobs for our youths; what should we produce; what should we export; should the state interfere in the market? Nigerians want solutions to these questions.
As a former envoy, how do we improve the standard of Nigeria's international relations and leverage our international standing for the benefit of the people?
I believe our standing is not good but will continue to be better. No one is going to give us a Marshal plan. We are not Europe, Japan or Iraq where investments poured in. We will have to secure assistance from institutions such as Bill Gates Foundation and others. It is also not enough to say that too much military rule has caused our problems. I prefer to posit that the "dividends of democracy" have to be better distributed for use to improve our standing in the international community.
Nigeria has the resources to make nations, especially in Africa worry if we sneeze or cough. The Federal Government has continued to reform our foreign policy machinery. But more funds will assist the work that has to be done, especially in elevating our relationship with organisations like the Economic Community of West African States (ECOWAS), where we need to co-ordinate more values, and capabilities.
As a Foreign Service Officer in Niger Republic in the 1980's, I had to dispel the notion among the youths that Nigeria was a dangerous country where you can be eaten as meat. I did not blame the French for this misinformation. As an ambassador in 2004, I was trying to convince our francophone brothers that it was not true that all Nigerians had the power to make people's body parts disappear.
Certain films from Nigeria did not help to portray Nigerians in good light. We need to re-brand. We must continue to emphasise our obvious strengths while working and praying to overcome our weaknesses.
What is your impression of development in Abia State and do you think the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) has a future in the State?
In spite of palliative measures taken by the Abia government, Orji must tackle the issue of energy generation, even if it means taking up local initiatives, especially utilising gas. The above measures will help to ensure an enabling environment to move the state forward.
Of course, if he also follows President Yar'Adua's seven point agenda, he will have all the prerequisites to ensure good governance now and possibly in 2011. Abia citizens are not happy with the current developments in the state. They are not yet ready to sacrifice and assist with necessary funds to assist current government. Hopefully good leadership in the state will result in these funds being transferred home, sooner rather than later. FULL STORY
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